Comments on: Rudder McBrokersons http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/ The Time Traveller (for so it will be convenient to speak of him) was expounding a recondite matter to us. Fri, 18 May 2012 18:30:03 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Woodwind http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2824 Woodwind Mon, 09 Apr 2007 19:16:21 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2824 Where will you be welding tonight ? Do not use S.S. underwater. Better off with rusty mild steel than mystery metal . Shiny one minute ,broken the next. Ever checked out Wharram sewn on rudder? No corrosion no noise no breakee We are in Antigua It's me, Jan. We saw that crazy Frenchman and hung out for several nights with Geoffry and Nancy from Panache. What a ___ fruitcake. Glad he didn't torch your wonderful boat. Cheers! Where will you be welding tonight ? Do not use S.S. underwater. Better off with rusty mild steel than mystery metal . Shiny one minute ,broken the next. Ever checked out Wharram sewn on rudder? No corrosion no noise no breakee We are in Antigua

It’s me, Jan. We saw that crazy Frenchman and hung out for several nights with Geoffry and Nancy from Panache. What a ___ fruitcake. Glad he didn’t torch your wonderful boat.
Cheers!

]]> By: joshua http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2820 joshua Mon, 09 Apr 2007 17:11:33 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2820 Jim Brown provided 3 rudder design options with the plans. The Skeg Rudder, A Break-away Rudder, and the Kick-up Rudder. The Skeg Rudder is recommended. However, both the break-away and kick-up designs will give better racing performance (because they are deeper, larger, and balanced). Joe (the builder of TimeMachine) intended to use it day sailing and racing on Lake Tahoe. The kickup rudder makes sense in this context. I don't think very many were made with the kick-up design. As we've discovered it is totally inadaquate for offshore use. It's simply not strong enough to handle the forces involved surfing down sea. In addition to being not strong enough the design is poor because you cannot steer when it is kicked up. Worse, the forces on the rudder box when the rudder is in the up position tend to tear the thing apart (as we experienced). Changing to the skeg rudder is big job because we need to cut a rather large hole in the hull to mount the skeg. Jim Brown provided 3 rudder design options with the plans. The Skeg Rudder, A Break-away Rudder, and the Kick-up Rudder. The Skeg Rudder is recommended. However, both the break-away and kick-up designs will give better racing performance (because they are deeper, larger, and balanced). Joe (the builder of TimeMachine) intended to use it day sailing and racing on Lake Tahoe. The kickup rudder makes sense in this context. I don’t think very many were made with the kick-up design. As we’ve discovered it is totally inadaquate for offshore use. It’s simply not strong enough to handle the forces involved surfing down sea. In addition to being not strong enough the design is poor because you cannot steer when it is kicked up. Worse, the forces on the rudder box when the rudder is in the up position tend to tear the thing apart (as we experienced).

Changing to the skeg rudder is big job because we need to cut a rather large hole in the hull to mount the skeg.

]]> By: cheyenne http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2819 cheyenne Mon, 09 Apr 2007 16:34:03 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2819 I heartily agree. We wanted to rebuilt it to be a skeg, transom mounted thing in El Salvador (like the standard design) but couldn't ever seem to get anywhere where we could haul out. And then we were on the move and blah blah blah, etc. This design is probably great for racing on a lake but sailing downsea in a big swell is not good. We got something hacked together out of parts of the old rudder and I sincerely hope it holds to Mexico where perhaps we can have something more suitable fabricated. I heartily agree. We wanted to rebuilt it to be a skeg, transom mounted thing in El Salvador (like the standard design) but couldn’t ever seem to get anywhere where we could haul out. And then we were on the move and blah blah blah, etc. This design is probably great for racing on a lake but sailing downsea in a big swell is not good. We got something hacked together out of parts of the old rudder and I sincerely hope it holds to Mexico where perhaps we can have something more suitable fabricated.

]]> By: the observer http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2793 the observer Thu, 05 Apr 2007 04:50:55 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2793 Over years I've heard/seen/read of alot of multi's having rudder issues (to be fair, monos aren't exempt). Usually it's catamarans, 'cause they have two rudders that have to lead to one steering system. Tri's generally do better because they have only one rudder and a main hull to mount it on. Things seem to go south however whenever someone gets the bright idea to gain more shallow draft with a kick up rudder. During open ocean sailing though, the sea seems to find a way to compromise anything except the most robust of steering systems. Searunners in their normal (jim brown designed) configuration are well built rudder-wise. A skeg mounted,transom hung rudder. Two separate strengths brought together. Too bad the designer of time machine thought to improve on it ( and I apolige for my backseat analysis, however I've sailed offshore in the trades too, so I'm aware of the stresses put on rudders). Surely this isn't the venue to get creative to save alittle draft) Sorry to be saying this, as you two seem earnest and probably don't deserve to be having to deal with this. Such is life. Over years I’ve heard/seen/read of alot of multi’s having rudder issues (to be fair, monos aren’t exempt). Usually it’s catamarans, ’cause they have two rudders that have to lead to one steering system. Tri’s generally do better because they have only one rudder and a main hull to mount it on.
Things seem to go south however whenever someone gets the bright idea to gain more shallow draft with a kick up rudder. During open ocean sailing though, the sea seems to find a way to compromise anything except the most robust of steering systems.

Searunners in their normal (jim brown designed) configuration are well built rudder-wise. A skeg mounted,transom hung rudder. Two separate strengths brought together. Too bad the designer of time machine thought to improve on it ( and I apolige for my backseat analysis, however I’ve sailed offshore in the trades too, so I’m aware of the stresses put on rudders). Surely this isn’t the venue to get creative to save alittle draft) Sorry to be saying this, as you two seem earnest and probably don’t deserve to be having to deal with this. Such is life.

]]> By: joshua http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2789 joshua Wed, 04 Apr 2007 19:44:38 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2789 We have a guy welding on it right now. I cut off the bottom part and he's going to try to reinforce it. We'll bolt it into place and forget the kickup feature for now. It didn't work anyway. We have a guy welding on it right now. I cut off the bottom part and he’s going to try to reinforce it. We’ll bolt it into place and forget the kickup feature for now. It didn’t work anyway.

]]> By: Peg Bowden http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2785 Peg Bowden Wed, 04 Apr 2007 14:40:31 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2785 Hey kiddos, Yes----there is a fascinating book residing in your head, Cheyenne, and you must put it together when you hit the mainland. My friend, Jan, has volunteered to edit it. She knows the publishing biz inside-out. I am always on the edge of my seat reading your adventures at sea. I may just fly down to Texas and hang with you guys for a bit when you hit terra firma. I LOVE the t-shirts and the US Coast Guard chapter of your journey. I want one---love, Mom/Peg Hey kiddos,
Yes—-there is a fascinating book residing in your head, Cheyenne, and you must put it together when you hit the mainland. My friend, Jan, has volunteered to edit it. She knows the publishing biz inside-out. I am always on the edge of my seat reading your adventures at sea. I may just fly down to Texas and hang with you guys for a bit when you hit terra firma.
I LOVE the t-shirts and the US Coast Guard chapter of your journey. I want one—love, Mom/Peg

]]> By: jeff http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2784 jeff Wed, 04 Apr 2007 13:36:49 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2784 Wow just went to kinkos to check out the sight. The rudder shure looks bad, we are still in Lake Charles LA. Will depart 10 days to the carib and Honduras maybe will see you. Your experiences are sooooo book worthy. Love Dad Wow just went to kinkos to check out the sight. The rudder shure looks bad, we are still in Lake Charles LA.
Will depart 10 days to the carib and Honduras maybe will see you. Your experiences are sooooo book worthy.
Love Dad

]]> By: TUCKER http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2782 TUCKER Tue, 03 Apr 2007 21:52:11 +0000 http://searunner.sv-timemachine.net/2007/04/rudder-mcbrokersons/#comment-2782 YOU GUYS ARE DOING GREAT-----HAPPY BIRTHDAY JOSHUA. LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING YOU IN TEXAS. WE JUST RETURNED FROM A THREE WEEK ROAD TRIP. SAW SOME OF YOUR OLD " HAUNTS"----THEY ARE STILL THERE. KEEP SMILING----LOVE TUCKER YOU GUYS ARE DOING GREAT—–HAPPY BIRTHDAY JOSHUA. LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING YOU IN TEXAS. WE JUST RETURNED FROM A THREE WEEK ROAD TRIP. SAW SOME OF YOUR OLD ”
HAUNTS”—-THEY ARE STILL THERE.
KEEP SMILING—-LOVE
TUCKER

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